The Commons

A conversation with Rachel and Egg (@rachel_gough + @klickstein)

Egg: Where are you calling from right now?

Rachel: I’m at my boyfriend’s family home in the south of France. I came over from Belgium, and I’m going back on Monday. I’m still based at Hal 5

Egg: How have you enjoyed that experience?

Rachel: Living and working at Hal 5? I’ve got one of the best gyms in Europe at my doorstep. The way they run the gym is so good, its a really tight community there. I feel very valued, teaching there is so fun. There are lots of really nice students, they all are really motivated to learn.

Rachel Gough

Egg: I’ve known a lot of people who have had bad experiences coaching, very refreshing to hear that it’s been an enjoyable time for you. Do you plan on staying there for the foreseeable future?

Rachel: 100% yeah. I actually just got a new apartment, right next to Hal 5. I’m pretty excited.

Egg: To start off my questions about Golden, I want to learn more about how this project came about. I went back in preparation for this interview and I rewatched “red” and it felt like that project echoed similar themes to Golden starting with the hair centered openings. In the description of Red it said “And, If you know anything about how I currently look, you’ll have a good idea of the concept of my next video.” Could you walk me through how this video came to be and how it connects to red?

Rachel: The original plan was that Red and Golden were all going to be part of one longer project which would’ve been for Motus, but obviously things changed. I’m actually kind of happy with the way that it went. I like that it’s in smaller part form, because it means I can focus more on what I want to show at one time. The concept of a video can change so much from when you start filming them until the end. I can have an idea of what I want to make a project about, starting with a concept, but I can only really give it meaning once I’ve finished the project. The concept I play with in Golden is self expression. With Red it was like having that red hair. Having control over your hair you can control how people perceive you, and how you want to be perceived. I really felt like that video was me, in that time period anyway. Being able to have the red hair made me feel more like me. The concept for Golden was to able to shave it all off and to still be able to be who I am without showing it on the outside. That was the mental challenge part of it. Golden is about coming back to my roots in a sense, quite literally as well. Discovering the whole reason behind why you do something in the first place. Seeing something for what it is. I think its such a nice thing that I only really realized that’s what it was going to be about once I had finished the project. It was a really journey discovering why I do this. I definitely struggled with that a bit during the filming process, so that’s what it came to be about.

Egg: In the description of Red you talk a bit about growing self confidence, and I can see how choosing to shave your head could be a direct progression of that thought, and trying to express it in how you present yourself within parkour. What was it like growing up with parkour, and growing up with a lot of eyes on you? How have peoples expectations of you have been a factor?

Rachel: One important thing to note is that I didn’t properly start training until I was 16. I was still young but I had gone through a lot of early developmental stages already. I got thrown into the parkour scene when I personally feel like you are at your most awkward. At least it definitely was for me. I had already developed a lot of who I was, and when I found parkour I realized how I didn’t fit in. It was a big thing for me, realizing that I now had to try to fit in. It led to a lot of pushing away of the person that I was becoming. Parkour prevented me from carrying on to becoming that person, because I felt like that person didn’t belong in parkour. Definitely having more eyes on me as well. It all happened really fast. I was sponsored by Motus after two years of training. I was still discovering who I was in this sport, and what my relationship to parkour looked like. I was really trying to conform to feel like I belonged. I felt a connection to parkour but I couldn’t see how I could be a part of it as the person that I was. Thats something I’m definitely proud of now, because I have come back to a lot of those things like my gender expression. When I was 16 I was terrified of people seeing me as too feminine. Now it makes me so happy to see people like Noa Diorgina for example, for representing the type of person I wish I could’ve looked up to. I would have been gassed to see somebody like that when I was 16. She is so unapologetic about just being a teenage girl in parkour. She shows that there’s a place for people like that. It’s so nice to see, and it’s something I try to do now. I want to show younger girls that it’s okay to bounce between dressing more masculine or feminine, and things like that.

Egg: I was going to ask about some what you just touched on, and the responsibility you feel to be a role model or example to younger girls in parkour. You mentioned that you feel like you’ve grown past feeling like you need to change in order to fit in, but do you feel like you feel a different kind of pressure to be the role model you wish you had when you were younger?

Rachel: Yeah, I think when anyone becomes aware that people look up to them you feel a certain amount of pressure. It definitely effects some people more than others. For me because I feel aware of how few role models there are in the sport, I feel more pressure to be a good one, and more pressure to be myself if that makes sense. Good role models really are who they are, and while I am aware that I am a role model its like “but who do I want to be? What do I want to show?” I try to just stick to things that make me happy, like doing these video projects. I definitely have felt a lot of pressure to do things that are ground breaking, like worlds firsts. I felt so much pressure to do those things because I have the skillset to do them. I’m really trying to fight against those feelings now. I know I have worked hard to get up to a high level in parkour, and obviously I still want to get to an even higher level, but there really is this feeling that if I don’t do something absolutely crazy, groundbreaking, women’s first, or something like that, I’m not going to be that athlete that’s remembered or be a role model. Im trying to come around to knowing that its okay, and I don’t have to do those things. I can chill and focus on things that genuinely make me happy. If there is something that happens in the moment that makes me happy, and is maybe a bit fucked up, then yeah i’ll do it. But I do just get so sick of the pressure I feel to do those sorts of things. Like a year ago I got so many comments saying like “oh when are you going to go do imax running pre” or “when are you going to do manpower” and stuff like that. Does it really matter? I have definitely felt pressure to be the role model other people want me to be instead of the role model that I want to be.

Egg: I think it is really valuable to be standing by what you want to do and not seeking out the challenges other people want to see you do. In my own journey in parkour I have felt a bit of imposter syndrome, where I have been given opportunities and feel obligated to fit the model of what a high level parkour athlete is supposed to look like. But doing so doesn’t do anything to alter the status quo of what parkour as a larger culture values. I think its super impactful to stand by your own choices to push parkour in other directions that aren’t just crazy challenges and worlds firsts. Returning to the video a bit, I felt like this was expressed through your movement choices. Your style in Golden felt more exploratory and expressive. I would love to talk about where your inspiration has come from movement wise lately, and what attracts you to certain challenges these days.

Rachel: I think the most important thing to note is that I personally don’t think my style has gotten that much more creative, it’s just that I put it in the video for once. In Red I definitely didn’t feel like I could put in anything that was not like a big jump, because it wasn’t valued. With Golden the main focus was that I wanted it to reflect how I actually train. I came to the realization that this year my training hasn’t been “yeah banger, banger, banger” it’s just been some fun little lines, and maybe like one or two fucked up challenges. I’m not doing fucked up shit like every week, and I wanted to show that like 70% of the time I just want to roll around on the floor. I want to do light, fun, and weird stuff. I still like more traditional parkour, and every once in a while I’ll still go for something that’s a bit fucked up, simply because I genuinely want to do it. Stuff that I have the idea for in the moment, not stuff I plan to do ahead of time. Like the ender in Golden, I had seen the spot map when we were in Helsinki, and saw a picture of the spot we were going to that Sunday. I was like “oh, I wonder if you could do this to there”

Rachel's ender clip in Helsinki Finland

and then I get there and I’m like “oh, that’s probably possible” start prepping it and I’m like “okay yeah lets go for it.” There was no like “Rachel you’ve got to do this” or like “I’m going out today to do something like super crazy.” But yeah I just wanted Golden to reflect how I actually train because I feel like Red didn’t do a very good job of that. I felt like Golden was a lot more accurate. In terms of inspiration, I think its seeing athletes doing stuff that’s less like “big” inspired me to be more open and feel less pressure to post only big stuff and only put big stuff in projects. I think the whole parkour culture has become more accepting of funkier movement and more creative styles, which has made it easier to feel comfortable putting that stuff in a project.

Egg: I find it super interesting that this progression of your style didn’t come out of nowhere in the past year, but rather it was that you didn’t feel comfortable highlighting that stuff in the past. That makes a lot of sense because a lot of what you did in Golden felt like it was quite developed stylistically. There’s clear progression to it that I think would take much longer than a year to flesh out. There were a number of clips that really stood out and stuck with me. Most of them are all movements that are very focused on the specificity of the space you are moving in. Movements that could only be done at that particular spot. As you said I also saw that approach with the “bigger” movements in the video. It felt like a step away from the typical process of learning a trick in the gym and then progressing it to bring it outside. You talked a bit about how you find inspiration, but I’m also curious if traveling more has played a role in that. Did having access to various communities and a wider range of spots help you progress your more playful approach?

Rachel: Traveling, yes, but not in the way that you’d expect. I traveled way too much this year, to the point that I was just so burnt out. I’d get to a jam and I felt like I couldn’t be bothered to do anything. So I would go off to the side and just start spinning around, doing some weird stuff. I was so burnt out, mentally and socially, I couldn’t think about doing any big running pres in front of everybody going “hey! hey! hey!” I was avoiding that after being at so many jams. Taking a break from that sort of allowed me to get more creative because I would be off on the side of the main spot. I met a lot of cool people through that as well. I actually met my boyfriend through that. I was just spinning around on the grass because I was too scared to go over to the main jam, and he was also spinning around in the grass for the same reason. It’s a great way to meet cool like-minded people.

Egg: Another aspect of the video I wanted to ask about was the partner movement. I might be a little biased but it was one of my favorite components of the video. Would love to hear more about how that idea came about. What feels different about moving literally with other people as opposed to training together normally?

Rachel: The reason behind getting the partner clips was just that I wanted to. I enjoy the idea of a more dance-y side to parkour. When you have someone else, and that little bit of choreography you’re getting to have to work together. It’s a cute little bonding experience. I just got some videos with Sen and Naomi, and I was like huh I wonder who else I can get, and I was like I really want to get a video with Egg, cuz they’re so cool.

Egg belly sliding under Rachel doing a bridge

Egg: Aw thank you!

Rachel: That’s it, I just had some ideas with Sen and Naomi, and wanted to get more clips for the video. I didn’t want it to be loads of pressure to get this person or that person, if in the moment there was some person there that I wanted to get a clip with, then I did. I wasn’t really planning it out. It was just a lot of fun.

Egg: Do you think that’s something you’ll continue exploring in the future?

Rachel: Yes, definitely. I want to look at it way more. I want to do more with my partner as well because its so much fun. When other people are down to make duo lines it really feels like teamwork. I’m definitely thinking about doing more videos with that sort of thing, maybe a project based just on that.

Egg: It feels like on of those things within parkour that still has so much room to be explored. Almost every partner clip in the video had something I had never seen before. It’s such a different way to access progression in a less intense manor than trying to do the biggest and scariest challenges.

Rachel: Yeah, it’s also just a great way to learn a new trick, or learn something new about someone. The process of getting a clip together feels like an achievement that you both make.

Egg: As we start to wrap things up I have some smaller questions for you. Do you have a favorite clip in the video?

Rachel: It’s going to sound really specific, but I’d say the clip of me and Naomi just laughing. If you’re talking about specifically movement, maybe the little circle with the handstand through it.

Rachel doing a handstand in a wooden circle

Egg: That was also my favorite.

Rachel: That one was kind of funny because the day we went to that spot I was like okay I really want to get something for the video, like a proper line, but my camera was on like 1% battery. I was like fuck what do I do? I started playing around in the circle and gave my camera and said okay you can only turn the camera on once I say go. I only got 2 attempts and then it died.

Egg: Damn, do you feel like part of why you were drawn to that challenge was because you knew you didn’t have a lot of time?

Rachel: Yep, I knew I wanted to get a clip, so I was like “what can I do that’s quick?” Then I saw the circle and was like “wait I actually have an idea”. I feel like it can be easier to get ideas when you’re restricted. Like if I have a restricted room to think, I feel like I have a place to start. I like having that.

Egg: You kind of just gave one, but do you have any fun stories behind certain clips in the video, stuff people might not know from just watching it?

Rachel: The end credits is Alec Reduker’s church piano recital. Me and Naomi went to it just because we wanted to. Just before that was when I did the kong pre. I actually have a way better video of the kong pre, like a version where I stick it perfectly. I just didn’t like the angle so I didn’t put it in. The worst part is that I was the one who changed the angle. I was like “oh Naomi can you stand over there instead?” And then I did it, stuck it perfectly, and then I was like “oh the angle from the start was actually way better.” So I didn’t even put the perfect stick in, because I didn’t like it. I don’t have a phone clip of that attempt, so maybe the perfect stick will never see the light of day.

Egg: So you feel like these days you care more about the look of your footage more than having the movement be perfect?

Rachel: Yeah, also the character that a clip has. I think sometimes maybe the movement is a bit worse but the clip shows more character, I really like that. I definitely do prioritize a bit more of the storytelling aspect of it, because that’s mainly what I’m doing with my projects. I’m trying to tell a story.

Egg: I’m curious about what you are moving toward next. Anything in the works yet?

Rachel: I have some ideas, but I don’t know. I feel like I can’t force projects, but I do have some concepts that I am going to play with. I do have a bit of a dramatic change happening in my life with changing apartments and stuff, and I think I’m going to be exploring that a bit. Also like I said earlier, I want to make some more projects with other people, making duo lines and stuff. Definitely some more stuff coming, I just can’t say exactly what yet until I’ve done it. Keep an eye out! I definitely want to make more of a name for myself in the video making world. Even if I don’t know what I’m doing, I’m gonna pretend that I do. Also if anybody comes at me for using an old fashioned camera, I didn’t just use it to look cool, I also used it because I don’t know how to color grade or edit, and an old camera is the easiest way to get away with doing boring editing.

Egg: I have one last thing I wanted to touch on. Relating to you wanting to make more of a name for yourself, as well as Motus ending, I would love to hear more about what its been like going on in parkour on your own and not being attached to a larger name or group.

Rachel: I think its caused a lot of good growth, positive growth. If this had been a project through Motus, I wouldn’t have edited it, and I wouldn’t have done half of the filming that I would’ve done. It would have been a completely different project. With Motus I never had to edit anything, because I was the one who didn’t know how to do it. I might still not know how to color grade and whatnot but I was definitely forced into a position where I was like “okay now I’ve got to learn at least the basics.” I now feel like I have complete creative control over what I make, which I think is overall a positive thing. Being able to put just my name on it makes me feel quite proud. I had to learn quite a lot to be able to put my name on it. Motus ending is still a sad thing, but I do think it was time, and still is the time for me to be me. The ending of Motus has allowed me to bring more. I feel like I can bring a lot just as myself.